Sep 13, 2021 Sep 13, 2021

Decent school with a mediocre GPA, No-name school with an excellent GPA, who is the better candidate?

I know GPA is an essential element in postgrad applications, I'm just wondering if there are two candidates, one is from a prestigious uni but with a mediocre GPA and the other one from a no-name school but has an excellent GPA, which one is professors prefer?

Specifically, now I'm choosing where to take my bachelor's and I have two choices (Bocconi and Waseda), which I posted before. I've heard of the competition at Bocconi is fierce and you can hardly get a GPA higher than 28/30 (converts to final grade 106/110), especially for non-italian. In Waseda, I can easily get an A/A+ and there is nearly no competition.

My final goal is to take an Econ/Stats PhD in the U.K(Oxbridge), and their lowest requirement for Italian applicants is 106/110.

Region

United States - Midwest

其他apac

Global / All Content

英国

Italy

Comments (4)

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PE
ProspectinPE-其他
Anonymous

Sep 13, 2021 - 7:53am

Perspective from a Brit (LSE/Imperial/UCL UG, Oxbridge PG):

You're thinking about this wrong - the most important thing for PhD admissions is evidence of research potential. For econ, this will likely include published papers and exceptional references.
I've never heard of Waseda but it does - from a quick Google search - appear to have a decent reputation/output. However, Bocconi will be very well-known in the UK and there'll be a lot of cross-pollination between Bocconi and top UK research groups, so adcomms may know your references which will always help.
That said, grades > institution by far in general - mostly because your references will be much better.
But the grades only matter so much - once you meet the broad qualifications (equivalent of a First or 3.7/4.0 GPA if you want to do a PhD at Oxbridge, the top three London unis, or Warwick), your references and research potential are far, far more important. This is slightly different to the US as people are generally admitted to the UK out of master's degrees and don't undertake much, if any, taught coursework in their PhDs.
根据项目和资金是如何设置up, you may need a strong "pull" factor - i.e. you have someone on the university side who actively wants to work with you. Network well in advance.
For econ, you're much better off going toLSEover Oxbridge in my opinion. For stats, there's a strong argument to say Imperial over Oxbridge too - and depending on your research interests, do strongly consider Warwick and UCL. Do not choose a PhD based on your institution, choose them based on your research groups - econ/stats is quite broad.
与美国顶级计划相比，英国的ECON计划非常差 - 即使LSE的位置也比现在的美国机构差得多（并非以前）除非您是队列的顶级或与他们的研究小组特别相关的事情，否则最重要的是美国大学。但是对于欧洲学术界，公司演出和IGO（LSE和牛津广场非常好），您会没事的。
In answer to your original question, I think I would go Bocconi here just because it's a much lower risk option. As long as you can finish in the top 20% or so you'll be alright, and focus on building good recommendations for research potential over being in the top 5%.
EDIT: Just saw your posting history and that you're a HS student - when I was writing this I thought you were applying for an MSc for some reason at these two universities before looking to do a PhD afterwards. As you'll probably have to do a master's before being admitted to a PhD, just do Boconni and don't look back. Don't stress about being top of the class as you'll probably go elsewhere prior to the PhD; then focus on getting exceptional references during your master's programme.

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Sep 13, 2021 - 9:32am

王, what's your opinion? Comment below:

Appreciate for your advices, really helpful, but I still have some concerns as follows：

As U.K has a strict requirement to applicant's GPA, once if my GPA is under 106/110 at Bocconi, I will be put in danger. I guess the PhD programs in U.S have a more flexible requirement to applicant's GPA and more diversity recruit. While I'm not passionate about academia and be hopeful to get a quant job after my PhD, do you think PhD programs in U.S is still a better choice because their flexible requirements?
是的，我认为西方的大多数教授都不熟悉日本大学的水平（Utokyo除外），因此他们只是搜索与其他大学一样的名字。从这个角度来看，Waseda绝对不是完全未知，因此您认为教授愿意从那里招募一名学生，因为每所学校都有自己的好学生？
Bocconi is really hard, 5% or even 20% is unrealistic for me I think, objectively. Thus, it's highly probable that I will fall down to lower than 30%, which hurts my GPA and rankings. Honestly, based on my observation, there are not many internationals get top grades.
Also, publishing papers at undergraduate level is nearly impossible for econ majors / Bocconi has a top-down teaching system as similar asLSE, and only graduate students can do some research projects with those famous professors at IGIER (their research center), so recommendation letters might be not very detailed and convincing.
总体而言，最终情况很可能是WASEDA申请人之一，其中有3.8/4.0 GPA vs Bocconi申请人（我猜是英国2.2）

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PE
ProspectinPE-其他
Anonymous

Sep 13, 2021 - 10:09am

A few points:

If you're interested in corporate quant gigs, a master's (especially from Oxbridge/Imperial - less so LSE) will often be enough. These jobs are incredibly competitive, however, and most people are coming in from a maths/physics/computing background not econ.
Providing you can get funding, UK PhD probably makes more sense for your ambitions as it takes less time.
If you want to actually be competitive for direct PhD entrance to Oxbridge/LSE/帝国/伦敦/沃里克,你真的需要发表(at least co-author) papers. Either that or you're truly exceptional as an interdisciplinary leader (Rhodes, Marshall, Schwarzman level) and you'll make a difference outside of academia. This is why predocs in the US are becoming increasingly common. Many of the top UK unis, as a matter of fact, do offer tonnes of research opportunities for UGs (would highlightLSEand Imperial in particular).
几乎可以肯定，在直接进入博士学位课程之前，您几乎需要做一个单独的主人。避免这种资金问题的一种方法是申请联合四年计划（MPHIL-DPHIL或MRES-PHD）。但是，这些都具有极大的竞争力，至少您将需要良好的研究经验（即使您的工作本身未出版）。
I don't know about the Italian grading system, but I highly doubt the top students at Bocconi are not competitive for the top UK programmes. Check LinkedIn for former Bocconi kids now at top UK PhD research groups and ask them about the grading.
If you think you can't get top 30% at Bocconi, then I'm sorry to break this to you but you're kidding yourself if you think you'll get into a econ or quant PhD programme at a top six (yet alone Oxbridge) UK university. Be realistic about your ambitions. You basically need to be top 30% at one of the six UK universities I've mentioned to get into most decent taught master's programmes at Oxbridge/Imperial/LSE, or top 5-10% if you're coming from the UK equivalent of somewhere like Waheda (lower Russel Group?). And research master's are more competitive than taught ones and will be prioritising your research potential.
Similarly, the people doing quant jobs atHFSare generally the best people in their programmes at the best universities. Honestly speaking, it sounds like you don't think that you're at that level. Now, that may change throughout UG as you mature, but I would urge caution in your case of planning UG > direct admittance to econ/stats PhD at Oxbridge > quantHF作为新来的UG学生。唯一的人（并且在Bocconi中会有这样的人）真正考虑到您年龄的可行选择是那些在学校或全球在学校离开考试，国际奥林匹克竞争者等中以全球或全球范围的人的身份的人。随着学位的进步，将发挥其潜力，但是您正在尝试计划自己的研究生职业，从而在这里射击自己。

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Sep 13, 2021 - 10:50am

王, what's your opinion? Comment below:

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Decent school with a mediocre GPA, No-name school with an excellent GPA, who is the better candidate?

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